Narrator: Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a cooperative effort among farmers retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife, educational programs, and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

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This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

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♪ Amanda: Well, good evening, and welcome to Making It Grow.

We're so glad you can join us tonight.

And I'm Amanda McNulty, a Clemson Extension agent.

And I get to come over on Tuesday and be with all these people who know so much.

It's continuing education.

And we have some special treats for you.

Mary Vargo from up in Greenville at the office there is going to make a bouquet Oh, she just says prettiest flowers.

And then we're going to talk with Andy Kabe at riverbanks Zoo and Gardens.

And of course, Terasa is an indispensable member of the crew because she can do everything that I can't do.

And yes, yes you can.

And but of course you have a big day job too.

Terasa: I guess you would say that, of course everyone has an important job within Clemson University and the extension service.

But I'm happy to coordinate the Master Gardener Program.

They really are a wonderful service because they help extension agents like Paul, who's a Master Gardener Coordinator to spread that research based information to those who are looking for it.

Amanda: Yeah it's so nice to think that there's some people out there Paul Thompson, who's the York county agent and you've taught master gardeners, a good many years now.

And you'll often have a great big, wonderful conference.

Paul: I think we have the best symposium in the state.

But anyway, yes, the York County Master Gardener Association.

They have a lot of activities that they do.

And, of course associations in and of themselves are so helpful to the agents because the master gardeners, you know, organize themselves and they work as a group and a lot more things get accomplished.

Amanda: Well I don't want to hurt anybody's feelings.

But y'all do have a pretty top flight symposium.

How about that.

And Katie Collins is a water resources agent.

And um I was on the team that said this is the best gall we need to bring her on board.

And it was it certainly was the right decision.

We're so happy to have you.

Katie: I appreciate your vote.

And I'm happy to be here.

I have to say when I did that interview, I was not warned that I was going to be zooming into the Making It Grow set.

So that was a nice surprise.

Amanda: And I think while we're here, can we wave and say hi to Bridget?

Yeah.

Hey, Bridget.

You're wonderful sister.

And we hope we always look forward to having her come and do something with us on the holidays.

She'd love to be back.

And my dear friend, Dr. John, my favorite professor at the University of South Carolina is back with us.

And although you are now retired, and Herot came down and we enjoyed having him with us.

We're so glad you occasionally.

But then continue to join us.

Dr. John: Well, I'm glad to do it.

And I want to tell you now that we're all talking about Master Gardeners that I was over here in Sumter a couple of weeks ago, and I was speaking to the Sumter Master Gardeners and we had a great time.

Amanda: They had nice refreshments too don't they?

Dr. John: Oh yeah And they had they had a nice present for me.

Amanda: And I was out of town that day doing something else with the show and I couldn't come over.

Sorry to miss you.

Dr. John: We had a good time.

Amanda: I'm so glad everybody has a good time when you're with us about that.

Well, Terasa, usually, you have some pictures us off before we go to gloom and doom.

We have some gardens of the week we got some pretty pictures to look at.

Terasa: We always do.

I think folks around the state are doing a wonderful job.

This is our chance to see what you're doing in your yards gardens maybe with indoor plants or perhaps a beautiful place that you visited.

We're going to begin with Dennis Johnson who shared sliced green tomatoes ready for frying.

From Christina Sarris assorted foliage plants, including hosta and coleus.

Lisa Fitzherbert shared a dragonfly perched on purple salvia flowers.

From Ivy Rice a colorful hanging basket and we finish up with Gary Jordan who shared Penny a Clumber Spaniel.

Although the breed was bred to flesh game from the brush Gary says Penny can't seem to distinguish between the brush and the gardens and is constantly exploring their flower beds.

I feel your pain.

My husband is trying to keep the dogs out of our flower beds, but they seem to get in no matter what he puts up.

But thanks everyone for sharing your photos with us.

Don't be shy.

Whenever you see us make the call on Facebook you're welcome to post your photos in the comments Or you're welcome to email me as well.

Amanda: Well that never heard of a Clumber Spaniel before we'll have to look that up find out all about it.

Terasa: I hadn't I hadn't either but it looks to be a very pretty kind of a creamy color accented with brown.

Amanda: Oh, that sounds nice.

Well Spaniel's are usually sweet but sometimes a little energetic.

Well have you got some questions?

We can try to help some with Terasa?

Terasa: We sure do.

We're going to start with a question from Chuck in Richburg.

Chuck reached out and said I planted some flowers to attract bees to my vegetable garden, but I never seen many bees.

Are there some flowers that really attract lots of bees?

Amanda: Gosh, Paul, I feel like almost awful.

I mean, when I go out at first if I stay still and look enough, I usually see some kind of little pollinators.

They may not be big, but what do you think this person ?

Paul>>: Well two plants I'm really high on for pollinators.

We have a pollinator garden that put in behind the office.

Part of that pollinator garden wasn't originally put there for a pollinator garden that's a oregano plant.

Oregano, you know, most people are using it for culinary purposes.

So they're constantly pinching it back.

So they don't want the flowers to eat the foliage.

But I have an Oregano plant that's been in the ground.

They're behind the office and concrete planter bed that we built.

When we moved into the office back in 2008, so this thing's about 10 feet across, and it gets pruned back once a year in the late winter.

But honey bees are all over that all the time.

And then bumblebees come to it other native bee species, you've got a lot of wasp that also visit that are solitary wasps that are beneficial, like Scalia and Wasp and things like that, Amanda: what time of year, because?

Paul>>: It is blooming, right?

Right now, it started blooming back in May, and it's gonna bloom, you know, another two, three months, some of it dries up and makes the brown seed head.

An Interesting story on that.

I was working in the garden several years back when a gentleman came to pick his daughter up from a Four H Camp going on, coming in the back door of the office to pick her up.

And he walked by and said you know what are you gonna do with those oregano seed heads?

And I said, Well, you know, this winter, I'm going to be cutting everything off he said, Well can I have the seed heads?

He told me it was originally from Syria.

And instead of using the foliage as their oregano herb, they actually harvest and grind up the seed heads and that is their spice, their oregano spice.

So, of course you had to try it, right?

Well, no, he actually brought me a bag of it months later, there was a bag with his business card, you know laying on my chair where he had stopped by but I mean, it's literally and you can see in this video that I took how many bees are all over this thing, even in the middle of the day when as hot as it can be?

They're there another plant that I been.

Amanda: How was the spice.

Did you enjoy cooking it?

Paul: Oh it tasted like a oregano So no real difference in the flavoring.

But just a different part of the plant to use.

But years ago, I planted some mountain mint where I saw I saw something growing out at Bartlett tree lab planted out one of their ornamental beds.

And I was walking by there one day preparing to teach the class or whatever and I saw all these pollinators all over it so I got a piece from him and I've been from that one piece is is generated many many plants.

But it's another plant that starts blooming right around the first of June and it blooms all the way up until the first frost these tiny tiny little flowers continuously opening on these flower heads.

And there are multiple species of pink anthurium which is the mountain mint group.

This one happens to be a short tooth mountain mint, but it just like the oregano, but even more diversity of the different kinds of insects that come visit, you see a lot more of the solitary Wasp on it.

Bumblebees honey bees, leaf cutter bees, you know, it's not not time for Mason bees are too early in the spring to utilize that.

But just all kinds.

Amanda: I think John in there one near the university that used to tell us about it doesn't have to just grow in the mountains.

Dr. John: No some of them are coastal plane species.

But the one that you're referring to is a great big patch that really got robust because it had a water line dripping through it constantly.

So I think that's the kind of a plant that one that you're talking about probably really likes water.

Paul: It will become more vigorous with a lot of water.

But it you know, I've had it in places where it didn't receive a lot of water and did just fine.

So probably makes it a little less aggressive and a little bit drier.

Amanda: So you could maybe have native plant nursery if you needed to get started.

Yeah, Paul: and you know, really just about any of them, I think are good.

They're listed in a lot of places for pollinators.

But it does spread but everything shallow.

So it's not hard to control it.

Amanda: Okay?

If it gets out of bounds, pull it out after a rain, if we ever have one, Paul: just go around, cut it back into a smaller, Amanda: I'm like to think that she would enjoy and as you said they attract a diverse group, right.

Paul: And you could make a tea out of the mint.

But then of course you can utilize the oregano to so Okay, dual purpose.

Amanda: Goodness gracious.

Well, that was fun.

All right Terasa.

So what's up next?

Terasa: Let's see if we can help Venus in Anderson, Venus said the stream in our backyard has noticeable erosion.

Is there something we can do to keep it from progressing?

Amanda: Oh, and what do we say?

We're all somebody's always downstream?

Katie: we all live downstream from somebody and this is a stream issue that we see a lot, especially in the upstate area, but really, throughout the state, lot of people are seeing issues with erosion and sediment going into their streams.

And part of the problem that kind of starts this is that you know, somebody buys a piece of property with a stream on it, that's part of the reason you probably bought that property, you want to see the stream, understandably.

So a lot of the times people will mow the vegetation down.

So it's kind of like turf, or very low growing vegetation down to the edge of the stream, which is not what would naturally be growing there.

And those, you know, those big shrub species and things that naturally grow on streams are adapted to this sort of dynamic system where something like a black Willow, which I brought a little representation at here, could fall over, because the stream starts to do some erosion.

But then when it falls over, this is such a hardy species that will just start popping up and growing where it's falling off.

So it's really well adapted to those dynamic systems.

And when we mow that back, something like turf grass just doesn't have the root system to kind of keep the banks and place.

Amanda: Well and if you've got something that's got some foliage and all when the raindrops come, they help intercept it, so it doesn't hit the ground so hard to and that can make a difference can it?

Katie: Yeah, absolutely.

And you know, even just the current from the stream, vegetation, like big vegetation on the edge that's kind of out in the water will slow the current near the shore.

And that will also reduce erosion as time comes along.

Amanda: I see all kinds of roots give us the background on this.

Yeah, show and tell you brought.

Katie: So we have a stream bank repair program that Clemson hosts workshops throughout the state and we have some online resources that people can check out.

And I coordinate the statewide efforts for that program.

And it's all about helping folks reduce erosion along their streams in a really cost effective way and kind of a DIY way.

So maybe they don't need to hire somebody if if the conditions aren't kind of too far gone that you need a full stream restoration.

But if you're just seeing some erosion starting you can do some practices like pulling back the bank to a more level three to one slope so it's not as aggressive of a drop and then you can put in some some matting made of natural fiber to slow erosion and you can put what we call live stakes.

Through that matting and the live stakes are just dormant season.

Amanda: The matting kind of like some kind of burlap or something or Katie: Yeah it's a coir matting so it's made with coconut fiber so it looks like a big net made out of kind of looks like hemp or burlap or something like that.

But it's made from coconut fiber.

We try to stay away from plastic on streambanks because we want something that's going to naturally biodegrade and not entrapped wildlife in the stream.

And so we encourage people to check out our manual on our website, which is at clemson.edu/sbr.

But the manual talks about these live steaks which is a type of propagation where you take cuttings during the dormant season, which in South Carolina is usually going to be around November to March maybe when you see the leaves not really on these particular species that you can live steak from.

And we have a list of species in our in our manual, but it's things like black Willow, elderberry, buttonbush, Virginia, sweet Spire, are all good species to do that with.

So you go out during that doorman season, you cut off about a two foot section of branch and you want it I call it the rule of thumb about the width of your thumb.

And we have more specific ranges in the manual.

But that's just a good rule of thumb.

And then you just put that directly in the bank, you don't really have to do anything to it you want to do it within a couple of days of cutting it, and you can keep it in a little bit of water in the meantime then this is a live steak that I cut myself from one of the research and education centers Clemson has, it's a black willow of species, and I just stuck it in this clear container with some soil back at the end of February.

So this is about four months growth.

So you can see a lot of green growth up top but a lot of root growth, -has holes to the bottom for drainage.- Yes I just put holes in the bottom of this.

And I stuck it in a tray with some water to kind of mimic those saturated soils that you would find on a stream bank.

But they're really low maintenance you just put them in the bank and we see something between like 50 to 80% success usually with these.

So a lot of them are going to sprout it kind of depends on getting the right placement on the stream bank.

But we detail a lot of that information in the manual, but it's very cost effective.

Because these live sticks you can find anywhere from maybe like 50 to 70 cents per live stake at a native plant nursery that sells them.

That's reasonable.

Yeah, it's not bad.

It's much cheaper than putting in like a container plant.

It also disturbs less soil to install this where you're just driving into the bank rather than digging a hole for containerized plant.

And even cheaper than that if you have some of the species on your property.

Or if your neighbors have some willow or some elderberry growing on their property you can go cut live steaks for free and just put them into your bank.

It's as simple as that.

Amanda: That is too cool for school.

Paul: One important note, -Yes.- Make sure you stick it right side up.

Amanda: Oh my Katie: Very important that is very important.

I usually tell people when you're cutting the live stake, the side of the branch closest to the trunk cut out of at an angle.

And that's going to make it easier put into the soil.

And it also helps you remember which side goes down.

Amanda: That was important.

John, you like to kayak a lot.

And like when I get to go down to the Congaree sometimes it seems like I'll see these big where the water slows down.

A lot of Black willow.

Dr. John: On the inside of the river bed of the curve.

It's where all the sand is being deposited.

Yeah.

willows, native willows.

Yeah.

They're wonderful.

Yeah.

Amanda: And so they help.

And that you know, and then other things, I guess are going to go there eventually to Sure.

Is this making a soil bank?

Yeah.

Okay.

Well, that was really fun.

Thank you so much.

Thank you.

Okay.

Well, John, I don't know what you're planning to mystify us with.

But um, I'm sure you got something.

Dr. John: Well, I do have some things and I'm thinking that this is a night for Vines.

-Vine-erama.- Vine-erama, we're gonna have Vine-erama and everything came out of our backyard.

So I want to share with you things that you might have in your backyard or in the garden, some of which are desirable and some which are not.

Alright so here's a little one and I'll hold it up, you can see that it makes flowers, little tiny yellow flowers.

It's a real pretty, and it's got these leaves that look like cucumber leaves.

And this is in fact in the cucumber family.

So it's a climbing vine.

It's an annual and look at that little flowers pretty.

This is called melonetts.

And after the flower, it'll make a little miniature watermelon that hangs down is in purple and you can eat these things actually.

Here's one right here.

I can hold it right there.

Right there.

Amanda: Okay.

Don't Don't Don't Don't laugh is that you making it it's funny to see it.

Paul: I think the melon is laughing?

Amanda: Melonett?

Dr. John: Melonett.

Then we have this is not a good thing.

This is a introduced clematis.

Or clematus.

And this is the one that's very, very pretty.

It's just it just goes everywhere.

This one is clematis terniflora and I put it down so it's still?

And that is an autumn blooming clematis.

Do you see this stuff?

Making plenty of very fragrant flowers in the autumn?

Amanda: Does it have a compound leaf with three?

Dr. John: Yes oh yes, it's got a more than that actually on the big leaves.

Okay are five or maybe?

Oh a lot five leaflets.

You see how that one works?

So that's clematis.

Amanda: And now do we have a native fall blooming clematis?

John: There is another one that is not nearly as aggressive.

And that's and that's, that's native.

Amanda: And what's the correct name for it?

Dr. John: That would be Terasa: Virginiana.

Dr. John: Virginiana.

Thank you.

Paul>>: But that blooms in the spring.

Terasa: Yeah they don't bloom at the same time.

Dr. John: Okay.

Yeah.

Amanda: Okay.

So don't get some of that from the side of the road and dont.

Dr. John: Don't plant that.

Now here's one that's a native species.

Not this one.

Let me show you.

This one is a native species.

And if you notice the way it's put together, it's got these two pretty heart shaped leaves at each node and you and see that it's cordate at the base, like a Valentine.

Now this is a native species that is actually pretty easy to grow.

This one is called anglepod.

And it's sometimes called a climbing milkweed.

And the genus is gonolobus if anybody wants to look that up.

But it makes a beautiful sort of purple that purple and green flowers and butterflies go for it.

So beautiful plant.

Did you just from seed, it'll come up from seed very easily.

Of course you have to get some seeds it's just beginning.

Okay then we have I think I put this one out of order.

And I think everybody knows this one.

Which is, crossvine?

And the top was a little Yeah, this part looks better.

So that each one of these, each node of the stem will have two leaves on it.

And most my students used to say well, Dr. Nelson now that looks like four leaves.

Aha.

Well, heres one leaf.

I just tore it apart.

It's a compound so it's a compound leaf with two leaflets.

And the little tendrils in between the two leaflets.

Oh and the little tendril is what will have it connect to a stem or to your wall outside your house.

So it's sometimes a bit of a weed, I think.

Amanda: But it's wonderful when it blooms for.

For pollinators, isn't it Paul?

Paul: Yeah.

Especially bumblebees.

I love those big flowers.

Big, beautiful.

You can go all the way down into it.

Red and yellow.

Amanda: And although I don't know how uses those little tiny things but it grows up a pine tree just fine.

Dr. John: Yeah, well, let's see using those tendrils, likes to grab the bark.

Yeah.

All right this one is a pretty vine and it's got these big old floppy leaves on it.

And they're pretty boring, except they're sort of they look like they might be a poplar leaf or something.

But this is a native vine and it's called Snail vine.

And it's starting to bloom now at a house.

And it makes these sort of dopey little yellow flowers.

But in the autumn it'll make beautiful red translucent berries.

translucent, or shiny, and you can almost see through and the seed inside will be snail shaped.

So this is called Snail vine.

Or calcculus Carolinus.

Amanda: So is there one seed inside?

Dr. John: One seed.

So technically it's a droop.

Amanda: But do you need a magnifying glass to see it or?

Dr. John: No, no.

Well, you gotta have fairly good eyes if you don't have a lens.

A hand lens.

Yeah.

So here's one that everybody knows, I think.

Alright, and this one is.

Look at it.

Amanda: I don't know if that's the bad one.

Or the good one.

Paul: Yeah, that's wisteria.

Dr. John: Yeah.

This is.

This is yeah, my book all wisterias are bad except for the native.

That's what I meant.

So this is Wisteria.

This is an oriental wisteria.

And it is a woody it is a woody vine that'll wrap itself around your shrubbery or trees or if it gets a chance.

So this is like one of the baddest of the Bad unless you can get the native one, which is really a gorgeous vine.

So this is wisteria sinensis.

Amanda: And there's a place that I ride by every day going back and forth.

And it says sustainable, forestry and one day, they clear cut most of it, which I mean trees are a renewable resource, but I was just curious.

And I ran into the people.

And they said that they were losing six acres of trees a year to the imported wisteria, that it wraps around them, and then it grows all the way to the top and so it cuts all the light out, I guess and it's just one of the worst things.

Dr. John: A lot of times for botanists or ecologists or hunters, whatever, out in the woods, you come across a big big patch of Wisteria in the middle of the woods.

And it usually means there was an old house.

Let's move on to the next part of vine-erama.

Now some people might think that this is going to be Wisteria too.

The problem with that is this has two leaves at each node whereas the Wisteria only has one.

So this is our cow ich vine or trumpet creeper, which is a gorgeous flower.

I think they're in sort of finishing up blooming around South Carolina now.

But they've got this is the one that makes a sort of cigar shaped orange flower that's so pretty and they fall off and you see, where's the vine and you see that the flowers are way up on the top of a tree where the vine is flowering, rather than down below.

Amanda: And then the fruit or the seed is showy too.

Dr. John: It makes a pod which is very impressive.

And the seeds are winged.

So they flutter around in the in the air.

Amanda: I can't think of anything better for a junkyard in a Lady Bird Johnson.

That's not one I would plant in my yard because it's really really, really aggressive.

Dr. John: It's it can be a problem and it'll also attach itself to your, your walls or brick wall.

All right, I got two more.

Okay.

And this is important.

So this is a very pretty vine and it's got these leaves.

Let me hold one leaf up.

And the one leaf looks like gonna sit it down so they can get a good can do that.

Okay thank you.

leaf has five leaflets on it.

Every now and then you'll find one that only has three leaflets on it.

Now we know what three leaflets might suggest.

But as you just saw him let it do these came off the very same vine.

So both of these leaves are from Virginia Creeper.

All right and Virginia Creeper the larger leaflets will have sort of uniformly sharp teeth, about the upper half of the of the leaflet blade.

So Virginia Creeper and a lot of people are a little bit of I use a pun a lot of people are itchy.

And thinking that this is a poisonous plant.

It may be if you're affected by it.

But I've got to say now Amanda I've said this before and we'll go to the very last.

Amanda: Well, let's talk about this one does not have you wish y'all Dr. John: or whatnot.

No, it's not at all related.

oxalic acid it's it's got other things a few people are affected could be and who are we to deny if somebody's getting a rash from handling this stuff?

If it happens then it happens.

But this is not related at all to the very last one that you are going to show.

And that is our beloved poison ivy.

I better not put it on the table but this is poison ivy.

And you can see that its leaves are also compound.

It might end up on the table.

Its okay.

leaf is absolutely three leaflets and you can see that they're very coarsely toothed and they don't really look to me of course I'm looking at these a lot but These leaves don't look much alike except that they are both compound leaves.

So poison ivy here which after you look at it for a while, you won't mistake it for anything else and then Virginia Creeper here.

So, the problem is these two crazy vines sometimes grow very happily together.

Amanda: And some people, like you so far, do not get a reaction but I will say that, yeah, that it's an acquired reaction.

And so I'm hoping that John, we don't hear one day that John's at the hospital and getting medicine or something.

Would you say?

Paul: I'd say don't go around shaking hands now?

Dr. John: Would you like to take some, home now?

Amanda: No thank you, but also they have I have to go out and you know I've got some places where they be my yards way too big for me.

And I find them coming out of the ground and try to cut them and paint them with the, you know following the directions with full strength and little throwaway brush.

But they have real that both of the vines look kind of hairy to me.

They look like they have it on the big vines.

I can they?

Dr. John: If you're out in a forest and you look in a bottomland hardwoods swamp, and you see these vines that are growing up a tree big old vines, this big around.

A lot of these vines will have all this hairy roots they do.

Like almost fur that's most of the time you see that?

That's poison ivy.

Amanda: And I think Virginia Creeper sometimes has something similar.

Dr. John: It's not it's not as much.

Amanda: But so if you're out there working in your yard in the wintertime, and see that don't think that you can pull that.

Dr. John: Poison ivy any part of the plant can be problematic, so that you don't fool with it.

Paul: Yeah, I found out even after they've been cut away and dried all completely out those woody vine parts are highly poison and worse case of poison ivy I ever got.

Amanda: And don't burn them eaither because it can become carried by, It can be in the air can't it.

You shouldn't grow it, it should be disposed of don't inhale it.

Terasa: But perhaps worth mentioning it.

It's very pretty in the fall it has some pretty fall foliage.

And wildlife valued the berries are consumed.

So I mean, certainly we want to be careful but it has a place.

Dr. John: And it is a native species.

Amanda: And so the reason that certain wildlife can eat it is because of coevolution.

You know, they're perfectly fine with it.

But um, I don't know about I don't know about dogs?

I don't think so.

Because it's yeah anyway.

But my dog has a nice fur coat.

So, yeah.

All right.

Well, thank you, John.

That was very instructional.

Well, great.

Yeah.

Thank you.

Okay.

Well, I think now we are going to enjoy seeing our friend from Clemson from Greenville, a Clemson Extension agent, Mary Vargo, who is just, she is a master of many things, but her backyard full of flowers.

She brings things down and just makes the prettiest bouquets.

I'm with my friend Mary Vargo who is the horticulture agent in Greenville.

And she has this super chaotic yard and she loves to mix colors and textures and everybody's getting married because for so long.

We weren't having any weddings.

So we thought we'd get you to come make a bouquet.

Mary Vargo: Yeah, no, I brought a lot of materials I like to have quite a bit to choose from makes it interesting.

So yeah, oh, palate.

Absolutely.

And I tried to kind of stay within you know same kind of color family a little bit of accents here and there.

But yeah I got this great eucalyptus filler foliage.

And, you know, some people like something grand and kind of crazy for the bouquet and I've never really decide how it's going to look until I start it.

I just go until it looks okay.

Amanda: And this was interesting because I always put the foliage in last.

Mary Vargo: I like to build from my house I like to see it and then I like to peek things in there.

Amanda: It's funny how we all work different.

Mary Vargo: Yeah, exactly.

But I like to kind of sort of get my my focal flowers in first These roses are really nice to kind of center them then Amanda: you and I spent some time when you got here.

Cleaning these roses were nice.

They didn't have thorns on them too bad, but we actually reduced the size of the rose a little bit we just took some of the petals off.

So don't feel like you can't do that.

If they're too big.

Then just go in there and say, you know, well, you know, just take some petals.

-Yeah, absolutely.- It's not a big deal.

Mary Vargo: Not a big deal.

I mean, I just kind of add as I go.

Amanda: And anything like that you can save for the little flower girl to throw when she absolutely yeah, no, Mary Vargo: you just kind of remove, remove the foliage or the outer petals.

If they're a little brown.

You still use them.

Mean roses have so many fair layers.

Yeah, exactly.

So when you're building this it kind of looks awkward if you're using it by hand but just kind of keep loosen your grip the The goal is to just don't hold them too tight.

Yeah things look a little rigid.

So sometimes you have to do a little bit of adjusting.

And sometimes if I want a form that I'm going for our use chicken wire at the base because that kind of gives me I'm able to create the form that I actually want with a bouquet.

Amanda: But then you've got this kind of deliver bid.

-Absolutely.- And cover so yeah so just be a little more relaxed.

Yeah, it'll just be Mary:Yeah, it'll just be kind of carefree and tiny.

Amanda: That's fun, too.

Isn't that really wonderful colors?

Yeah, tell that you like this color palette, right?

Enjoy using it?

Mary Vargo: Well I try to I try to stay within that sort of same color or whatever.

But I like to mix in unusual or wildflower type flowers within a bouquet it gives it a little bit more of a unstructured look to it.

So these are some corn flowers that I grew in my backyard.

So some of these I picked up at the florist shop and some local flowers from back home and Greenville.

Yes, beautiful ranunculus we're not killing the growers have done such a good job of growing.

Amanda: Often certain flowers like we're not ranunculus don't ship well.

And so y'all are so fortunate because you've got some local outlets, that's a big push towards people farming flowers.

Mary Vargo: Absolutely We have a really great group of flower farmers in the Upstate very active, you know, and we have, you know, Greenville is a huge place for weddings.

So they stay very busy with supplying the florist with beautiful, flowers that you just can't find at your local florist.

So it really gives your bouquet and you're looking at everything else.

Just a really unique sort of look.

Amanda: Yeah, it reflects where you are.

Yeah, so much fun.

Mary Vargo: Yeah.

So once I kind of get to this stage, I kind of have to switch hands a little bit because it gets a little too busy.

So then, I'll just do some adjusting.

Some things will fall through.

I'll just pick them back up.

Uh, huh.

Move them around.

Until I kind of like where the shape is kind Mary: of coming together.

In there.

Yeah, Mary Vargo: got to do some some adjustments.

But you that's kind of natural.

Just kind of keep playing with it until you do get that shape that you want.

I think I need some more white in here just balance things out to beautiful white, us too.

Yeah, no, they're super great.

And then something a little bit.

So we've got a lot of big shapes.

So we've got that eucalyptus looking nice.

I'm going to add in some more filler flowers to kind of break up the larger shapes in this and give it a little bit more of a airy feel.

Amanda: Oh, very nice.

Mary Vargo: Oh, broke that tulip.

Okay, we got more.

Amanda: that's not the most flexable of stems.

Mary Vargo: And then sometimes when you add in a whole lot you just got to keep moving with it.

But this is when something like that chicken wire will come in.

Amanda: You got that big piece of chicken wire, you got to wrap up and Mary Vargo: yeah, it can get a little out of control.

Let's see.

How's that look in I think we need to bring in some more fillers in there and maybe some more greenery too.

Okay so we're at a point where we got a lot in here.

What do you think it needs?

I think it looks pretty balanced.

We've got a nice sort of balance of frilly big things.

Amanda: These and these complement each other well.

Mary Vargo: as far as adding some more colors, maybe at the bottom.

Okay, let's see.

Add that into echo that.

Yeah.

Usually, if you have something sort of larger and you always want to put one piece in.

So does that does it work for little small accent pieces.

So if I put something like this stock in, that smells incredible.

It kind of still balances it out a little bit.

Yeah without looking too busy.

But I think I like that so I will wire it up.

So this is sometimes the hardest part you.

Amanda: and I both know that with our film because there's a little place at the bottom where you cut wires so that you don't ruin your blades.

Really important.

Mary Vargo: Yeah, mine are all rusted and every I will leave them out.

Amanda: I know so I get sidetracked and I leave.

And thank God Mary Vargo:And thank God they're red you know otherwise I wouldn't be able to find them.

A tool that I really love though.

Do you have a soil knife?

Amanda: No, I don't know.

So, like, I use my Drexal Sawzall to cut holes in the ground.

Mary: I love my soil knife.

I have tree roots.

Okay, but that thing is so handy.

It's super sharp.

I been dividing a lot of my perennials this year and it just saws right through.

Amanda: Yeah, it's so does the Drexel Sawzall yeah.

Mary Vargo: So then at this point, kind of, yeah, it looks great.

So I'm just gonna get the stems all one sure level, you can kind of feel like a little bit longer stem you can definitely cut them long.

But since they're all a little bit different shapes and sizes, Mary Vargo:I think we're good on this so then I'm going to hand this to you.

And we'll get the ribbon.

Got quite a bit of different colors textures.

And I really I like the long sort of looking really nice romantic feel to it.

Let's see.

So I think we should tie all these things in here.

Amanda: All righty.

Mary Vargo: Yeah, and if you want to trim some of the ribbons you can but I kind of like leaving it dangling, you just want to cover that wire up.

So that's usually what I'm aiming for there.

And then if you want to do some adjustments bring some up.

Just be real careful, Amanda: since you really don't want to snap the stem.

At this point, Mary Vargo: you just want to make sure all the flowers are on display, you're able to see them.

And then there you have it.

Hopefully your DIY bouquet is you're happy with it.

And it's perfectly lovely.

Yeah, Amanda: look at their beautiful smile.

Just great.

Great fun.

Mary Vargo:Yeah, thanks for having me.

Amanda:Yeah, let's do this more.

Mary:Yeah absolutley.

Amanda: When Eric Shealy came to see us he brought some flowers, and some of them have lasted a long time.

So I have some Pineapple Lily.

That's really striking.

And then I had um, some Rudbeckia and a glad and some other stuff this is just a hodgepodge hat but there's nothing wrong with that.

And speaking of Eric Shealy who works at Riverbanks Zoo & Garden let's talk about the fact that we get to go up and spend some time talking to Andy Kabe and seeing what was happening at Riverbanks.

♪ I'm talking to Andy Kabe who's the director of horticulture for Riverbanks Zoo and garden.

And Andy no matter what time you come here.

This place is just a blaze with color from flowers, but also from greenery.

Andy: You know, Amanda, there's always something blooming here at Riverbank.

So that's one thing we pride ourselves on.

And, you know, in South Carolina, I mean, we can garden 12 months out of the year.

And we certainly do here at Riverbanks, which is a joy, but also you never get a break.

You never get a break.

And I think my staff would tell you that it's just as soon as something's looking good, it's time to pull it out and plant the next thing.

Amanda: And there is a lot of that that you do.

Right now we're kind of in a transition period.

And so we've got snapdragons and larkspur and things like that.

But we've also, I guess, due to Eric Shealy, and some of your other staff members, he's got a lot of spring things that are that were ready early to put out.

Andy: Yeah, you know, Eric grows a lot of our annuals down on the greenhouse and gets things started for us.

So we normally start usually about the middle of April, switching beds out.

And we've gotten most of the garden done that were over at the zoo, switching things out over there.

But definitely being able to grow our own plants, that helps us number one that helps us get exactly what we want.

We don't have to go searching around for it.

And it gives us you know, ready made plans to right down in our greenhouse so we can just take right up here to the garden and put straight in the ground.

Amanda: And also you've got a lot of conifers, many of which have some color blended in with the green, Andy: you know, the conifers are great, especially, there's so many varieties out there that might had hints of cream or gold on them or white.

They're just great to help brighten up things, you know, evergreens, it just it really brighten things up and can kind of break up the whole monotony of just too much green.

Amanda: Well and also when you've got little things on the ground you need some larger scale things behind them.

And so that's one of the things that happens here.

You don't have just a carpet of one thing, although you may see a large swath of it, but it's not going to be too Just a total bed of it.

Andy: right in doing layering things important, based upon their height and their spread.

That's important too.

And, you know, we don't want this to be a very two dimensional garden.

We want it to be 3d We want you to see from the ground up.

Amanda: You have a lot of fool proof plants, you've got hellebores that I think jumped into beds, Andy: Everywhere Yep.

But they're wonderful.

Oh, it's a great thing to have seed in.

And dry shade.

I mean, there's not a whole lot better for dry shade.

Amanda:Yeah but also I guess, partially due to one of your former directors of horticulture.

What a huge Krenim collection.

Andy: Yeah, when I started here, I kind of inherited a Krenim collection, our pre previous management here decided Krenim, were going to be a core collection at river bank.

So I inherited the Krenim collection and had been building it ever since.

And, gosh, I think we're up probably close to 200 Different varieties right now.

You know they're just so great.

I mean, they're, like you said foolproof, depending on the variety, our first ones might bloom in February or March or last ones, maybe in November, December, just depending on the frost so.

Amanda: And right now you've got some regular lilies that are starting to come in.

And again, they're just not, there's not much problem that you don't have a lot of problems with those, I think they'll try to find plants that aren't going to need a lot of attention, time to be spraying, Andy: Right and we you know we've we've grown enough things over the years to know what works, what doesn't work, what looks is best, and what looks as best with the least amount of care.

So all those are important factors in in selecting plants for a particular area.

So we do a lot of that.

Amanda: And I believe that this is hard work.

And people have to work when it's hot and when it's cold.

And you really try to give your staff some decision making.

Andy: sure they have different areas in the garden zoo that they're responsible for, for a large part we try to let them design how how they feel and what inspires them.

I think it gives them a sense of ownership.

And I think lots of times, you're much more apt to want to take care of something and devote your time to something that you have a vested interest in that you pick those plants, Amanda: if you decide to come in the Botanical Garden entrance.

As you walk by the garden you have wonderful pitcher plants there.

I think everybody should get down and look at how they work.

Not only you know, the tube, yes, insects, but the fly was very complex to make sure it gets pollinated.

Andy: And you knowthe interesting thing about pitcher plants is the actual pitchers themselves.

Lots of people think that's a flower because it's just so pretty and but really that's actually a leaf, it's a modified leaf, the little pitcher with the two minutes, that's actually a leaf, but the flowers when they come in the spring are absolutely amazing and yeah, one kind of neat thing that I sometimes do on garden tours is I'll pull an old pitcher off and I'll open it up especially if they're kids in the group, and they can see all the bugs in there.

Yeah, that worked really great.

Until one time I was on live TV doing it.

And there were fire ants in there.

I was getting stung left and right and trying to keep my composure on live TV and act like it didn't hurt but uh, but it was a good example.

They really do insects do go down in there.

Amanda: a good reason to tell people the public that they're not ours.

I love century plants and you've got a lot of them out front if you came up on the tram side.

And I'm thinking, gosh, are they going to you know and you said fortunately now, we need to pay more attention to cultivars that are available, right?

Andy: There's so many different cultivars of century plant out right now.

They're variegated cultivars, they're green cultivars are gray cultivars, blue cultivars, I mean there are a whole bunch of different ones out there.

But you can just about find one for any setting in the garden, it doesn't have you don't have to have a six foot by six foot space to put in Century plant necessarily, there are some compacts that fit well in the garden.

Amanda: And one of the things that happens here is things aren't going to stay as static as they might, at home, you've got some really, really big crape myrtles and crape myrtles are going to be susceptible to crape myrtle scale.

And some of them have kind of gotten bigger than their space requires.

So you don't change things.

Okay, you know, this Andy: garden opened in 1995.

And I think the first things were probably planted in 94, we're getting close to 30 years on some of these plants that had been in the garden since day one.

And what we're seeing now is after close to 30 years, we're experiencing the growing pains of a maturing garden And a lot of these things are planted in confined spaces.

And after you know, 20 or 30 years sometimes it's time to do something new.

And whereas I would cringe getting rid of some of these things in my own home because they're such beautiful trees.

Our purpose here is a little different than the home landscape.

We want you to see new and different things each time and, you know after a plant's been out for 25 or 30 years in the trade, you know, maybe we need to showcase something new and different.

So that's what we do.

Amanda: And you've installed some ginkgo.

And I'm, I'm thinking, Gosh, this place is nice, has a lot of sun plants and but you said again, staying up on the cultivars, you've got some that aren't going to need to Andy: Yeah and especially especially in our walled garden, a lot of spaces over the zoo that are confined.

You kind of have to pick and choose and we don't have room for a ton of trees as well.

Especially in the botanical garden trees that will get big and mature and that's why you were scratching your head when I saw I planted the you sweat saw I planted the ginkgo.

And when I told you this is a, an upright columnar cultivars, that's not going to cast a lot of shade.

It made sense.

But that's the thing now is people are breeding so much and discovering new plants that, you know, they're taking your plant that you know, and making it work breeding it so it will work in a different space.

Amanda: Of course when I got here had to walk up into the Children's Garden and all that, you know, people say, Oh, little children's feet, they're not gonna make a difference because you've got a great big green space there and they can go barefooted but I think about school yards, little children's feet can be very compacting.

And so y'all have to give that turf area there.

A lot of special care.

Andy: Yeah, that turf gets well it gets special care, no care at all at the same time.

That area has probably been mowed about twice and six years old and keep it down.

The children keep it mowed down.

If we keep it well aerated, weeded, fertilized, it can keep up with the kids.

Amanda: And then it's hot.

And mothers come and sit with babies and strollers and their children are playing.

And you've got so many opportunities for shade.

And instead of just a boring canopy umbrella canopy, you put stuff on it looks kind of like palm fronds Andy:We gotsomething to look kind of thatched like and, and that's that's the thing that we have to really take into consideration.

And just both of our horticulture and overall layout of our zoo and garden is number one we attract a lot of kids.

So you need shade, you need shade for the kids, you need shade for the moms and dads who are out there watching them.

So we factor in shade quite a bit.

Whether it's through plants, or umbrellas or something like that, we definitely factor in shade a lot or teradactyl wings or teradactyl wings like in our in our dino dig our giant sandbox, theTeradactyl that goes create shade, Amanda: and I saw kids sitting up there and then there was actually a small shoe that I guess one of your staff had found that they put out in case somebody came back on the span the shoe that came Andy:After a busy day or a busy weekend you find some shoes and water bottles and stuff like that.

But kids are having such a good time they forget about their shoes.

Amanda: Then oh water, what do you got a wonderful water.

I mean, everywhere you go, you can hear water, which I think is very soothing.

But you've got water, children can play in Safely, Andy: we've got play water too.

And that's great.

In our children's garden waterfall junction that opened in 2016, we made sure there were water elements included.

So kids could have a safe place that their parents can watch them to splash and play.

And so that's going to be opening up here soon again for the summer.

It just really is nice.

You know, in another month, we won't be able to sit here and have this conversation because you'll hear all the kids out there playing.

Amanda:I can't wait.

Well, I think it's just wonderful.

You're right here, it's so easy to come in, you got the you can have the botanical garden then the regular zoo, both of which are beautiful, and your staff takes care of both.

The containers are so lovely.

I remember the last time we were here we found that y'all even pick pansies and feed them to the turtles.

Andy: Absolutely.

We try to make sure nothing goes to waste, Amanda: including bamboo and every tree limb that falls.

Andy: We find a reason way to use it, repurpose it, for sure.

Amanda: we had such a good time today and if other people want to find out about your hours and when you're open what's the best way to do that?

Andy: The best way is to go to our website or Facebook page, all the information about our hours of operation, everything you need to know can be found there.

Amanda: Alright.

And um, perhaps you should bring your sunscreen with you.

Andy: Absolutely.

♪ Amanda: Any time of the year is a good time to go to River Bank, Zoo and garden.

And there's great stuff for the kids in the summer.

So I encourage you to make a trip.

Paul, you've got something coming up that I think I may take advantage of because I forget things all the time and it's getting worse.

Paul: Yes, Dr. Bob Lowski.

And I put together an online Plant identification class.

It's asynchronous, so self paced class.

Amanda: So you don't have to start at the same time right and show up at the same time you Paul: You have 60 days to complete it but it's a it's a you know, it covers trees, shrubs, ground covers, and vines and not not just identification but also their use.

So we have a lot of lot of information about using them in the landscape and nice pictures that he and I have taken over the years, you know, landscapes situations and that kind of thing.

So it's a wonderful course not a huge number of plants to learn, but certainly gives you a good foundation.

Amanda: Okay, and we've got a place you can see on the screen where to go to Paul: get more, you can go the online catalog.

Amanda: Thank you so much.

And thank every one of y'all for being with us tonight and all of you for joining us.

We'll see you next week right here on Making It Grow.

♪ Narrator: Making It Grow is brought to you in part by Certified South Carolina is a Cooperative effort among farmers retailers and the South Carolina Department of Agriculture to help consumers identify foods and agricultural products that are grown harvested or raised right here in the Palmetto State.

The Boyd Foundation supporting outdoor recreational opportunities, the appreciation of wildlife educational programs, and enhancing the quality of life in Columbia, South Carolina and the Midlands at large.

McLeod farms and McBee South Carolina family owned and operated since 1916.

This family farm offers seasonal produce, including over 40 varieties of peaches.

Additional funding provided by the South Carolina Farm Bureau Federation and Farm Bureau Insurance and Boone Hall Farms.